Stephen Kinnock: 'I have a really personal understanding of what people are going through'

Stephen Kinnock (Photography by Louise Haywood-Schiefer)

Sienna Rodgers

@siennamarla

When Labour entered government in July, Stephen Kinnock was handed the job of minister for care, and with it the somewhat unenviable – and certainly daunting – task of fixing social care.

It is a problem that every government has, to quote Boris Johnson, “flunked” over the last 30 years (and which he proceeded to flunk too). And it is a job made all the harder by the way politicians have repeatedly used any proposal for reform as an opportunity to attack their opponents – often very effectively.

“Every time a political party attempts to make changes, sadly, those attempts have been torpedoed because of partisan politics. And that is not at all a party-political point. The Labour Party needs to hold its hands up, and recognise and admit that we’ve done that just as much as others have done,” Kinnock tells The House.

“Labour tried to introduce big reforms to adult social care; the Tories shot it down as the death tax. Theresa May to her credit tried to do it in 2017; Labour shot it down as the dementia tax. And on it goes.”

This frank admission also serves as the government’s justification for setting up an independent commission on adult social care, rather than advocating reforms and pushing them through. Is Labour kicking the can down the road?

“I think we’ve hit the ground running,” Kinnock replies. Listing the £3.7bn uplift to social care authorities, the £86m uplift to the disabled facilities grant, new guidelines on care tech and new responsibilities to social care workers who will carry out basic health checks, he adds: “But I totally recognise there’s a lot more to do. There is a need to have a really deep, long-term think about the future of adult social care.”

That work will be led by crossbench peer Baroness Casey via a commission, set to launch in April, that will report in 2026 on medium-term recommendations for changes and by 2028 for longer-term ones. Fundamental to it is cross-party consensus.

“I absolutely recognise the very valuable work that Andrew Dilnot did. When you look at charging reform, clearly, we shouldn’t be just starting with a blank sheet of paper”

“We have to, this time, put the horse before the cart. We’ve got to develop that consensus across parties, and that will form the basis of a durable and sustainable, long-term solution for adult social care, because this is the kind of issue that goes well beyond one electoral cycle. This is one of the challenges of our age, for a generation and more, and the way to fix it is to bring cross-party consensus,” Kinnock explains.

But why the need for consensus? The solution will be political – that is unavoidable. And if this government, with its effective majority of 163, doesn’t tackle it, when is the much-needed overhaul ever going to happen?

“It’s about building some foundations that are going to be solid, so that when proposals do come forward for a new model of care, which could potentially include a new funding model, they are going to be durable. They’re going to be built on solid foundations, rather than built on sand,” the minister insists.

The first cross-party meeting on care was due to take place in late February, but fell through when one of the invitees had a scheduling conflict. There is no new date at the time of writing, but Kinnock wants the talks to start before April, “to frame the launch of the commission”.

It is not just the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats being brought in for discussions – Reform and the Greens are also on the list. Many would say the chances of them all agreeing on a controversial set of reforms are infinitesimally small.

“We are hopeful that all of the other political parties will enter into these talks in the spirit of cooperation and compromise that is the basis for consensus,” says Kinnock. “The lack of a properly functioning adult social care system is making a major contribution to all of the other challenges that our health system is facing – everybody can see that. It doesn’t matter what political colour you may have.”

He praises Ed Davey, who cares for his disabled son, and offers the Lib Dems’ focus on care as proof that a cross-party approach could work: “I thought the video that he put out during the election campaign, showing the amazing care and compassion that he has for his son, was very, very moving. That’s just one example of the way in which the discourse in Westminster is changing around this subject.”

The commission will come to its own conclusions on how to change the care system – “Baroness Casey is a very independent person who is not backward in coming forward,” Kinnock notes. But for him, is the main problem with the current care set-up that people lose their savings or that it leads to bed-blocking?

“Both are absolutely crucial,” he replies. “People’s worries about, is my loved one being cared for? How are we going to afford it? How are we going to access the care that we need? When that care assessment comes, what kind of package am I going to get? How is that going to help me to afford to look after the people, the person that I love? That absolutely has to be resolved, because the cloud of fear and uncertainty that hangs over a family when those kind of things are having to be considered is a serious problem for our society and economy.”

Asked whether it is wrong in principle for people to be forced to sell their home to pay for their care, Kinnock says: “We need to get to a point where people have an adult social care system that relieves them of the pressure to have to cut into their personal finances and make sacrifices that would have seriously negative impacts on their own financial position in order to care for their loved ones.”

But he admits that, particularly in light of the Ukraine developments, “we’re operating in very challenging fiscal environment”. “Those are all of the things that Baroness Casey is going to have to balance and look at to get to a situation, which I am sure will not be seen by everybody as perfect. There are no perfect solutions in all of this, but there is clearly huge room for improvement,” he adds.

“There is some very worrying evidence of exploitation in the visa system, and we are taking steps to crack down on that”

Sir Andrew Dilnot’s care commission, which reported to the Coalition government, recommended a cap on lifetime social care charges and a more generous means-test. Kinnock suggests the government will be building on those proposals: “I absolutely recognise the very valuable work that Andrew Dilnot did. When you look at charging reform, clearly, we shouldn’t be just starting with a blank sheet of paper, because we’re not.”

As for the future of the social care workforce, does the minister want to see a reduction in the sector’s reliance on migrant workers?

“I do think it’s important for us to reduce our reliance on workers from overseas. They play an absolutely vital role in our health and care system, and they are hugely valued. I also think there is some very worrying evidence of exploitation in the visa system, and we are taking steps to crack down on that,” he says.

Kinnock reveals he is working closely with Home Office minister Seema Malhotra on the link between adult social care visas and modern slavery. The government is looking at “supporting people who tragically are being exploited”, he says, and there are “all sorts of appalling abuses” that must be “eliminated from the system”.

Unpublished figures show more than 800 people working in care homes or people’s residences were recorded as being potential victims of modern slavery last year, The Guardian reported in January. This represents a surge; one which has been attributed to the February 2022 decision, made under Johnson, to relax immigration rules in a panicked bid to fill thousands of care vacancies.

Kinnock is also clear that the government hopes to professionalise the care workforce. “It’s about making adult social care as attractive as it should be, as it deserves to be. It’s a complex, demanding job, which requires head, hand and heart,” he enthuses.

Emphasising that carers must be both skilled at working with people both physically and emotionally, he adds: “That is just not reflected in the pay packages of the average care worker. We should not be surprised that when you’ve got that mismatch between the very demanding nature of the job and the salary that’s on offer, you’ve got 130,000 vacancies in that part of our labour market.”

A key factor in this professionalisation drive is the government’s union-boosting plan for a “fair pay agreement” in social care. Instead of fragmented negotiations with individual employers, which can see outsourced workers treated less favourably, there would be a sector-wide agreement thrashed out between employer and worker representatives.

“As soon as the Employment Rights Bill gets its royal assent, then a negotiating body will be created and the deal will be hammered out, not just around an adequate and attractive pay package but also around terms and conditions.

“So, what kind of career structure, what kind of training could you have? What kind of ladder can you get on when you when you become an adult social care worker? Let’s ensure that there’s proper esteem for that profession. How do we professionalise that workforce and make it really attractive?”

While driving up pay and standards has obvious benefits, by making care more expensive the government is nonetheless setting itself up for an even bigger challenge in reforming the way people pay for it.

“Radical transformation is there for the taking”

Kinnock has a broad portfolio, covering everything from care and mental health to GPs, dentists and pharmacies, but much of his time has recently gone to Labour colleague Kim Leadbeater’s assisted dying bill, currently going through detailed examination by the bill committee of which the minister is a member. Unlike his boss, Health Secretary Wes Streeting, Kinnock backs this change to the law, and is responsible for developing the department’s strategy for it.

Asked whether he is concerned about the lack of flexibility in the two-year deadline for delivery of assisted dying, which is built into the bill, Kinnock suggests he is not. “I think a lot can be achieved in two years if the bill passes. The government is neutral on the bill, but my job on the committee is to advise on workability. Our current position is that it’s workable,” he replies, though acknowledges that it “requires further work” and “proper in-depth analysis”, which officials are undertaking now.

And is he worried that if it becomes law, Parliament will not have an opportunity to check whether the training stipulated has been done properly before assisted dying is rolled out? Again, the health minister seems relaxed. “I’m sure that the Health and Social Care Select Committee would be looking very closely at this kind of thing. So, I do think Parliament would have ample opportunity for scrutiny.”

Kinnock will not say whether he believes the Terminally Ill Adults (End of Life) Bill will save the government money: “I wouldn’t want to pre-empt what’s in the impact assessment, but yes of course it will be considering the overall costs, or not, financially.”

Yet he is straightforward on the question of private provision, which makes many critics of assisted dying uncomfortable, but which does not trouble him. “Kim has said that she wants this service to be an integral part of the NHS, meaning free at the point of use. Certainly the advice that we as ministers have given her is we’ve clearly understood that that is her wish, and that is a wish that can be delivered and carried out. Now, free at the point of use doesn’t preclude the use of independent contractors to deliver the service. So, yeah, we’re comfortable with that.”

For Kinnock, who was born in Tredegar like Welsh Labour and NHS giant Nye Bevan, his role in government has renewed personal resonance. His mother Glenys, Baroness Kinnock, was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s in 2017, and Neil, former Labour leader Lord Kinnock, cared for her at home with the help of professionals.

“In many ways, they became part of the family,” he says of his mother’s carers. “It’s just one example of why care is so important, because what they provided for mum was really important in terms of looking after her, but also for dad, because it gave him some respite and enabled him to do the things that he wanted to do during the days.

“But he still looked after her every night, fed her, and got her to bed, and things like that. In many ways, it brought us closer as a family, and we’re fortunate that we were able to look after mum in a really good way and right until the end.” In 2023, Glenys died aged 79 from complications of the disease.

“I feel that I have a really personal understanding of what a lot of people are going through. That is why what we’re doing is so important. Because there’s just nothing worse than worrying about whether your loved ones are being looked after properly. That’s just one of the worst things that anybody can experience, and that’s what this government is going to fight tooth-and-nail to alleviate and to address.”

The care minister tells The House he is determined to “completely transform” the role of disabled and older people in our society. “It’s not just about adding years to people’s lives, it’s also about adding life to their years,” he says.

“This is an incredibly exciting moment for us. Radical transformation is there for the taking. We’ve just got to get the system and the country with us, working together, to really go for it.” 

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